Civic Type R

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Footage from the recent launch

13MB wmv file added on Tuesday 30th January 2007

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Beefmeister 01/02/2007 09:45:00	Well, its definitely growing on me, especially after hearing that engine....
Landy_girl 01/02/2007 09:46:08	Beefmeister said: Well, its definitely growing on me, especially after hearing that engine.... Yes same here
Marc W 01/02/2007 10:23:05	Me also. I noticed it's getting a slagging off in the Honda forum though!
warren182 01/02/2007 10:37:42	Autocar review wasn't great. Think the Clio 197 with the Megane drivetrain will be worth waiting for.
Landy_girl 01/02/2007 10:57:21	warren182 said: Autocar review wasn't great. Think the Clio 197 with the Megane drivetrain will be worth waiting for. but I dont like french cars...
Road_Terrorist 01/02/2007 11:27:37	Marc W said: Me also. I noticed it's getting a slagging off in the Honda forum though! Well it's quite a different car from the old one and really a whole new demographic they are aiming at. It's certainly no Type 'R' (but really how big is the market for a stripped out, lightweight racer hatchback?), the last proper Type R was the EK IMHO, they have got fat and soft since then. This newby doesn't even have the trademark doublewish bone suspension all round, which was always a something the Civic had over rivals, but at least it looks good . What I suspect is that the new CTR is actually some sneaky marketing by Honda bods, they know Type R has a fair bit of street cred, for want of a better term, while something like Type S or VTi doesn't (just look at all the people putting Type R badges on... well everything). So what I suspect they have done is make a Type S, but call it Type R so the buyer can bask in the happy feeling of having a 'genuine' Type R, while later they build a more hardcore Type RR or something that will be the proper Type R that only a bunch of hardcore nutters will buy.
stigcv8 01/02/2007 11:42:10	here is my 2p The old car didn't do anything for me, it looked like a souped up granny waggon and ultimately was camp in the extreme. This was personified by someone I used to work with who looked just like Jeremy Spate, and he used to spend £70 regularly on highlights in his hair. I found the interior poor beyond compare, the aluminium had washed off or peeled away (this in a few type r's I had the misfortune to ride in) and frankly the car felt like little more than a shopping trolley with a little extra go. Moving to the new civic, I love the look of the standard car - it is a modern work of art for such a mass produced machine, however, this translates into the new type r that looks no different to standard other than some really shitty looking spoilers (which ruin the car) and some recaro style seats (teh win!!1!). Moving on to the sound of the engine being sexy, maybe it is the recording, but that thing sounds like any other normal small capacity car only it manages to string out the annoying asthmatic buzz for an extra few thousand rpm. I am sure the car will drive very well but the car just has zero appeal. I am considering the standard new civic as a possible future run around but when you consider the Ford ST is in the same price range, I cannot but help feel that Honda have fallen flat on their face.
LuS1fer 01/02/2007 12:40:33	stigcv8 said: here is my 2p The old car didn't do anything for me, it looked like a souped up granny waggon and ultimately was camp in the extreme. This was personified by someone I used to work with who looked just like Jeremy Spate, and he used to spend £70 regularly on highlights in his hair. I found the interior poor beyond compare, the aluminium had washed off or peeled away (this in a few type r's I had the misfortune to ride in) and frankly the car felt like little more than a shopping trolley with a little extra go. Moving to the new civic, I love the look of the standard car - it is a modern work of art for such a mass produced machine, however, this translates into the new type r that looks no different to standard other than some really shitty looking spoilers (which ruin the car) and some recaro style seats (teh win!!1!). Moving on to the sound of the engine being sexy, maybe it is the recording, but that thing sounds like any other normal small capacity car only it manages to string out the annoying asthmatic buzz for an extra few thousand rpm. I am sure the car will drive very well but the car just has zero appeal. I am considering the standard new civic as a possible future run around but when you consider the Ford ST is in the same price range, I cannot but help feel that Honda have fallen flat on their face. I loved the old Civic Type R. The subtlety of the design was not to everyone's taste but there was no doubt that the subtle spoilers performed a function, the car was classy in a Golf GTi way and went like stink. I actually liked the 3 door breadwagon especially in revised headlight form but hated the old 5 door which lacked proportion. Moving to the new Type R - it's a Max Power chavmobile and I wouldn't buy it unless they produced one that stopped me looking like I was a burberry-wearing monkey. It has no class and is more XR3i than Golf GTi. Then again, whilst I applaud Honda for the bravery of the new Civic design, I'm not a fan of it, it's far, far, far too fussy and smacks of 70's detail for the sake of it. Front reminds me of the mirror-grille old Fiesta and the full-width lights of those nasty 80's facelifts. It also looks far less practical than the old one and lets be honest, that wasn't very practical in access to the rear seats.
10 Pence Short 01/02/2007 12:49:28	stigcv8 said: I found the interior poor beyond compare, the aluminium had washed off or peeled away (this in a few type r's I had the misfortune to ride in) Which aluminium? The only aluminium I remember from the old car was the gearstick!
GlenMH 01/02/2007 12:50:10	LuS1fer said: It also looks far less practical than the old one and lets be honest, that wasn't very practical in access to the rear seats. I suggest you go and have a play! The rear seat practicality is awesome: access is good, the seats squabs go up (I can get a bike in across the car behind the drivers seat) or the whole lot can be folded flat, the boot is really deep as there is no spare wheel. I have had one for over 10000 miles and the only complaint is really poor rear 3/4 visibility. As a body shape, it is good. As a Type R - I am not so sure. Glen
stigcv8 01/02/2007 12:55:23	10 Pence Short said: stigcv8 said: I found the interior poor beyond compare, the aluminium had washed off or peeled away (this in a few type r's I had the misfortune to ride in) Which aluminium? The only aluminium I remember from the old car was the gearstick! thats the bit, it was as if the nob had corroded with the sweat/grip of the drivers palm
10 Pence Short 01/02/2007 13:03:23	It's a solid piece of alumium. It can't 'wash off' or peel away. Edited by 10 Pence Short on Thursday 1st February 13:03
stigcv8 01/02/2007 13:07:17	10 Pence Short said: It's a solid piece of alumium. It can't 'wash off' or peel away. Edited by 10 Pence Short on Thursday 1st February 13:03 trust me and my eyes when I tell you that it had huge areas where it looked like it had washed off in patches - probably oxidisation with the sweat of the palm, who knows, but I am just pointing out that this was in at least 2 civic type r's.
10 Pence Short 01/02/2007 13:11:57	stigcv8 said: 10 Pence Short said: It's a solid piece of alumium. It can't 'wash off' or peel away. Edited by 10 Pence Short on Thursday 1st February 13:03 trust me and my eyes when I tell you that it had huge areas where it looked like it had washed off in patches - probably oxidisation with the sweat of the palm, who knows, but I am just pointing out that this was in at least 2 civic type r's. I only ran mine for 125,000 miles, so I'm not sure. The aluminium scratched, but never ever had any 'patches' on it. When you're in a hole, stop digging!
stigcv8 01/02/2007 13:23:20	10 Pence Short said: stigcv8 said: 10 Pence Short said: It's a solid piece of alumium. It can't 'wash off' or peel away. Edited by 10 Pence Short on Thursday 1st February 13:03 trust me and my eyes when I tell you that it had huge areas where it looked like it had washed off in patches - probably oxidisation with the sweat of the palm, who knows, but I am just pointing out that this was in at least 2 civic type r's. I only ran mine for 125,000 miles, so I'm not sure. The aluminium scratched, but never ever had any 'patches' on it. When you're in a hole, stop digging! no hole and not digging, you can choose to believe me or not it is entirely your call but ask yourself why would I feel the need to bullshit on such a little detail and then keep going to "save face"?
lil'nick 01/02/2007 13:26:29	warren182 said: "Autocar review wasn't great. Think the Clio 197 with the Megane drivetrain will be worth waiting for." For a more rounded view, Car and Autoexpress were both very positive, car went as far as crowining it the Hatch King, so I wouldn't under estimate it. I think the engine note sounds great in this vid, it is a bit brash in Red, Black or deep bronze will be the colours to have I reckon.
mackie1 01/02/2007 13:32:48	stigcv8, I think you're being a bit harsh about the quality of the old one, it was well put together and it was lots of fun to drive. On the one I drove (02 reg) the gearknob was solid aluminium, did it change in later models?
10 Pence Short 01/02/2007 13:34:40	stigcv8 said: why would I feel the need to bullshit on such a little detail and then keep going to "save face"? You've answered your own question! Sorry, I've been purposely obtuse. There is a bit of silver plastic trim in the CTR (the centre console of the dash and the door grabs), but the marks you likely saw were black scuff marks on it. The bits of silver trim on mine used to scuff a little, it looked like the silver finish had come off, but all you had to do was wipe the scuff mark off and you're back to silver plastic trim again. I had lot's to criticise the CTR for, including the gear knob (the one in the Integra was proper titanium rather than aluminium), but the plastic crap silver trim wasn't one of them!!
stigcv8 01/02/2007 13:41:29	mackie1 said: stigcv8, I think you're being a bit harsh about the quality of the old one, it was well put together and it was lots of fun to drive. On the one I drove (02 reg) the gearknob was solid aluminium, did it change in later models? I'm not disputing it wasnt solid, I am just saying it looked like it had washed off almost as if it was plasic/paint simply because of what (if it is solid alum) would appear to be some form of oxidising. 10pence, believe what you want
stigcv8 01/02/2007 13:45:09	well memories are known for being faulty, i am certain it was on the nob and still stay convinced but then theres no ing gracious way to alter the past 2 hours!
jimbeaux 01/02/2007 14:49:40	A VERY young fellow in one of these pulled up along side my Mustang a while back and started making noise. He was completely outfitted with the giant fart can exhaust and multiple aftermarket gauges clustered about his dash. Ugly scoops and tailfins as well. He had an odd-colored ball cap (Chav-like I suppose) pulled down over his eyes. The biggest of all the mistakes he was about to make was that he had his equally young and impressionable girlfriend sitting next to him. Now he must haved blown a lot of burger-flipping job money on this array, so it had to be painful when I reached the next light a full second ahead of him. I was going to tell him good run, but he was so pissed and embarrased in front of his horrified looking girl that he didn't even look up. I know, a little immature, but I just wanted to score one for the 40 something crowd around here! Edited by jimbeaux on Thursday 1st February 14:51
stigcv8 01/02/2007 14:53:04	jimbeaux said: A VERY young fellow in one of these pulled up along side my Mustang a while back and started making noise. He was completely outfitted with the giant fart can exhaust and multiple aftermarket gauges clustered about his dash. Ugly scoops and tailfins as well. He had an odd-colored ball cap (Chav-like I suppose) pulled down over his eyes. The biggest of all the mistakes he was about to make was that he had his equally young and impressionable girlfriend sitting next to him. Now he must haved blown a lot of burger-flipping job money on this array, so it had to be painful when I reached the next light a full second ahead of him. I was going to tell him good run, but he was so pissed and embarrased in front of his horrified looking girl that he didn't even look up. I know, a little immature, but I just wanted to score one for the 40 something crowd around here! Edited by jimbeaux on Thursday 1st February 14:51 posted a similar story a while back, only me and my mrs in my smart car vs some young land and his missus in his "riced" hyundai accent coupe or something, the poky 1.3 type thing. Anyway we wasted him so much so my mrs was genuinely in need of a toilet stop to stop from wetting herself! ah the joys of power/weight ratios - mind, at 85mph my limiter cut in and eventually he got past so regained some of his cred with his missus but we were laughing too much to care
stew-typeR 01/02/2007 16:37:08	the initial concept car i liked, the released car just dont look right compared. the wheels are horrible. i hate the fact cars are now designed by marketing depts' rather than designers/engineers.
joesnow 01/02/2007 17:04:37	Honda can't win. The original Type R concept was high end engineering in a road car. Money was spent on hand finished engines, and more expensive suspension - just look at the original civic (EK9) and the Integra (DC2). The rest of the car was basic, hard, yet well screwed together. As sporty Hondas became more popular people wanted a more comfy car with the dynamics of Type R, the last civic (EP3) was still basic inside, but a bit quieter and refined for a wider demographic - EK9 and DC2 had no sound deadening material in the body. This trend has continued, and Honda has made the car that people want. Instead of spending all of the cost on engine and chassis, they have used some of it in the cabin and appearance. Those of you dissapointed in the size of wheels on the production car should be glad that it's not shod with heavy 20" rims (btw, they are similar design to the NSX-R wheels). Smaller wheels and higher sidewalls give adjustability and allow the suspension to be firmer. I'm sure it still performs very well, Hondas are mostly about the engines, and I for one am looking forward to a test drive - involvement over grunt is what Honda have always been about. Those of you that moan are missing the concept. Honda had to make the car the people want, and besides, how many of you have driven the bloody thing? Edited by joesnow on Thursday 1st February 17:06
Gazboy 01/02/2007 17:25:13	I have. It ain't a TypeR, it's a fully loaded VTi with a TypeR badge slapped on it's arse. The only TypeR Honda have made in the last 14 years that has anything in common with this bit of badge marketing is the Accord Type R. It's nothing like the orginal CTR, ITR, NSX-R (NA1 &2) in concept. It also isn't like the current JDM CTR either which has remained true to the TypeR roots.
Beefmeister 01/02/2007 20:09:40	Just noticed that bit about the Clio 197 Cup with the Megane drivetrain - now that would be worth buying. Autocar mention it this week too. Imagine this : ...without the dodgy graphics, but with 230bhp and an LSD and you have one mighty attractive machine.... And it'd probably still be cheaper than the Civic...
thekirbyfake 01/02/2007 20:27:06	The last of the lightweights has gotten plump. They've messed around with the gearing to keep a quick 0-60mph time but the 0-100mph time now takes 2 seconds longer than the Focus ST.
LuS1fer 01/02/2007 20:48:02	Had a look at those road tests. What the hell have they done to the dash? It's a mess.
waynepixel 01/02/2007 20:49:52	I must admit I love the sound of the engine and always have. But the car just does not do it for me, and the interior is just plane wrong. But I think the reel disappointment about the car is that it did not have a new engine, and the car deserved that. i am in the Clio on this one.
kaivaksdal 02/02/2007 13:36:32	I agree with everyone else here too! The new CTR is just too soft, too heavy and too slow. The type-R badge used to sstand for Racing and was hardcore. ITR DC2 is still a legend... As the marketing men want more of the market, they have to bend to public needs and wants. More safety equipment, more gadgets, it all weighs down what COULD be a nice car. Keeping v-tec n/a is a nice touch, but there is lots more power to be had from that engine. Bring on the Type-RR and let's see what Honda can really do. I for one will not be changing from my Focus ST!
flasher 02/02/2007 14:07:46	I'm sure it's great to drive but I actually prefer the original. I hate the look of the new civic in any guise and I'm sure I'm not the only one. Looking at the pictures in the latest issue of car I don't like the interior either. They judged the ST, Golf and Civic very close but went for the civic on handling. The point they seem to be missing is that you have to like the whole package and I don't care what the handling is like, it looks ridiculous. Triangular exhausts, my arse. I wont be changing my ST for one of these, I'll wait for the Focus RS or consider a Golf R32........
cyberface 02/02/2007 14:14:53	Oddly enough I love the design, it's very distinctive on the road and I love the odd positioning of panel shuts etc. I even like the triangular exhausts FWIW... However I'm also of the opinion that, like the Clio 197, it's got fat. All the 'hot' hatches have got so damn heavy that they need more than 200 bhp to be quick, which is utterly insane. Let's face it, 200 bhp was a LOT of power not so long ago - it was 3 litre engine stuff, and normally found in big fast saloons. The Honda should be really fast - however there's only so much you can do when the car is so heavy. Weight hurts in all directions - acceleration, braking, cornering... and to get the incisive responses and great braking you need to add larger brakes / wheels / tyres / bigger suspension, all of which adds weight, etc. Vicious circle. I'd like to see Honda follow through on the Type-RR and offer a lightweight version in the spirit of the DC2. If they don't, then it's a pretty clear indication that PHers are an insignificant minority, and the number of people who would genuinely choose a more uncomfortable / less well equipped car to gain driving purity is too small to make financial sense...
dunno 02/02/2007 15:17:45	You always get some pleb who manages to say something like "SCUUUUUREEEEE" half way through the video
VinceGT 31/08/2008 21:45:45	I have just bought one and I personally think it is amazing. I actually love everything about it.. and that engine.. just wow its so much fun and it can take a pounding all the fun after 4 - 5000 RPM fantastic car.
R TOY 31/08/2008 23:42:11	A mate joined our LeMans trip in a new Civic type R this year. I was quite impressed by its performance but its owner seemed dissapointed when my Tuscan left him for dead leaving a Peage station. (Maybe expecting a bit to much?) But the most surprising thing was the fuel consumption. The Honda used more fuel than my 3.6 Tuscan, a Porsche Cayman S and......wait for it a 996 Turbo ! It is fair to say that he engaged in some 'spirited' driving but i hadnt expected his fuel bill to be the biggest. I seem to remember a fair quantity of oil being added before the return trip aswell. Boot spoiler came in handy tho Edit to add..He loves the car btw so cant be bad, hope you enyoy yours Vince.Get some trackdays booked.. Edited by R TOY on Sunday 31st August 23:48
deviant 01/09/2008 00:51:25	I'm still really really tempted by one of these...but my judgement keeps being clouded by the impressive gobs of torque offered by its turbocharged rivals. I know its not really fair to compare the engines like that but take the Focus XR5 (ST to you lot) and its very very relaxed driving style but it still has the performance. The styling and interior of the Civic is just fantastic though and very unique.
shadowninja 01/09/2008 07:36:54	deviant said: The styling and interior of the Civic is just fantastic though and very unique. Yes, it's the best for a reasonably priced car. As I like to say, are you driving off your driveway or undocking from the USS Enterprise?
insanojackson 01/09/2008 08:53:13	I must admit i dont flog mine everywhere but my computer is showing an average of 32.6 mpg over the cars 9500 miles, i think in reality its closer to 30 but i think thats ok for a performance car.
Marc W 01/09/2008 09:43:26	Mines does about the same, even if I really push it, it's not dropped below 28 and I've even had it up to 34 on a long steady motorway run.
insanojackson 01/09/2008 10:00:41	Marc W said: Mines does about the same, even if I really push it, it's not dropped below 28 and I've even had it up to 34 on a long steady motorway run. i filled up the other day and reset the trip, after my 13 mile journey to work it was showing 50.9mpg!!!! thats decent in anyones book
deviant 01/09/2008 11:33:41	insanojackson said: I must admit i dont flog mine everywhere but my computer is showing an average of 32.6 mpg over the cars 9500 miles, i think in reality its closer to 30 but i think thats ok for a performance car. And this is another massive draw to me. The turbocharged cars seem to return an impressive MPG figure (L/100KM here in Aus) but I have not yet seen any realworld figures close to the manufacturers specs unless the car was granny driven to the freeway and driven only on the freeway. The Honda's (including teggy type R's) always seem to return impressive fuel use.
havoc 01/09/2008 13:07:35	The Type-R's will show a greater drop-off in economy once you get into higher average speeds - blame the short-gearing. Honda engines are typically mapped to run rich as well, so a piggy-back chip with a re-map can sort out some more fuel economy with little risk. As for the turbo'd cars - the direct-injection ones (e.g. VAG) seem to do surprisingly well, with the trade-off being a dull engine-note, while the 'old fashioned' ones (Focus, Astra) are appalling...but again, possibly over-fuelling for safety?!? Overall I'd say a CTR should get better economy (marginally) than e.g. a Golf GTi, unless both a driven at high M-way speeds a lot (when it'll be reversed). Both will be better than an ordinary turbo-petrol. In all honesty though, unless you do high-miles, I wouldn't worry too much - the depreciation, tyres, servicing and insurance will comprise probably 3/4 of the overall running costs!
otolith 01/09/2008 15:27:26	havoc said: Overall I'd say a CTR should get better economy (marginally) than e.g. a Golf GTi, unless both a driven at high M-way speeds a lot (when it'll be reversed). Maybe, although the official figures imply the Golf should be 11-12% more frugal than EP3/FN2. There's so much variation between drivers, though, that I can well believe that either car might prove the more economical for a given driver's style.
deviant 02/09/2008 00:06:06	I think most turbocharged cars run hugely rich from the factory as a safety net....the manufacturers are wise to people either being cheap and filling up with 91RON or bolting on an exhaust and induction kit that will mean a slightly raised boost pressure and leaner running.

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